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Dr. Zogby CNN Appearance about Imams Plane Removal

CNN
Posted on Wednesday November 22, 2006

ANDERSON COOPER 360 DEGREES – Aired November 21, 2006 – 22:00 ET

“Muslim Clerics Yanked Off Airliner”

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM.

JOHN ROBERTS, CNN ANCHOR: Very few people can say they haven’t done it. You’re at the airport waiting at the gate. You look around at your fellow passengers. Ever since 9/11 we’ve been told to watch out for the unusual, the suspicious.

But who among us can say our eyes don’t always stop even for heartbeat on people who simply look Arab or Muslim, whatever that may mean? It happens every day. What doesn’t happen every day, though, is this: a group of Muslim clerics heading home from a conference on tolerance getting yanked off of a plane straight into a national uproar.

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The question is, what, if anything, does this story say about the kind of America that we’re becoming?

We talked about that earlier this evening with James Zogby. He’s the president of the American-Arab Institute, and Jan Ting. He’s a law professor at Temple University.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROBERTS: James Zogby, what do you think is going on here? Was this a prudent exercise of caution on the part of the airline staff? Was it a fundamental misunderstanding of another culture? What do you think?

JAMES ZOGBY, PRESIDENT, AMERICAN-ARAB INSTITUTE: Well, I think on the part of the passengers it was a misunderstanding. I think that the airline is seemingly admitting that there is a problem and they’re going to investigate, but certainly the rules here seem to be very clear.

I remember Norman Mineta, when he was secretary of transportation, made it very clear that these kinds of events that were taking place all across the country after 9/11 should not occur.

I don’t believe they should have occurred in this instance, and I think that these—these imams have every right to pursue some—some action here.

ROBERTS: Professor Ting, what do you think? Was the pilot wrong to ask the imams to leave the flight?

JAN TING, PROFESSOR, TEMPLE UNIVERSITY: Well, you know, I’m not in a position to second-guess people, because I wasn’t there.

What I want to say, though, is I want to make two points. One is context and one is balance. I think it matters that we’re talking about an airport. I think security concerns are understandably greater at an airport than they are at, say, a restaurant. And so I think it’s appropriate for us to worry, particularly given our history and the 9/11 events of five years ago. It’s appropriate for everyone to be security conscious. We tell people to be on the lookout for unusual things, and we expect them to report these things. So context, I think, matters.

And secondly, I think balance matters. We have to balance the inconvenience, the potential inconvenience to individual passengers, compared to the possibility of a threat to the lives of hundreds or even thousands of travelers. So I think balance matters.

Finally, I’m not sure where the TSA was in all of this. All of the reports that I’ve read talk about the police being there. Presumably that’s the TSA. I mean, the TSA has some responsibility here. So if there’s blame to go around, I’m not sure it can all go on the airlines. Some of it ought to belong to the TSA.

ZOGBY: Well, let’s—let’s look at this, though. The fact is that these gentlemen went through the screening process. The point here is that if they go through the screening process—the metal detector, luggage search, et cetera—and are found to be safe, then the only suspicious activity is their appearance, the fact that they spoke in Arabic and that they prayed. That is prejudice.

What I think that the airline needs to do—what the country needs to do, is take a collective deep breath and say, “Let’s get over it.”

We have Muslims living with us. They’re part of our country. They’re part of our culture. We need to do a lot better at understanding this community and respecting this community. Simply saying the name Allah cannot be deemed suspicious behavior.

The airline failed in this regard. And I think that they’re going to have to examine their procedures a lot more closely. If you get on the plane and you’ve gone through all the procedures and you have nothing with you that is untoward, then in fact, people have to tell the passengers, please, understand that we are living in a complex society and don’t overreact.

ROBERTS: What do you think about that, Professor Ting? If people had a greater understanding of the Muslim faith perhaps they would have seen this as very innocuous behavior.

TING: Sure. I understand what Jim is saying. But on the other hand I don’t think you can say that once you’re past a certain point that there’s no return. You can’t second-guess yourself and that you can’t express any concerns about safety once people are on the plane.

So I don’t think there’s any absolute rule there against the airlines saying, “Gosh, you know, here’s something we weren’t aware of. Let’s—let’s take another look at this.”

And TSA if they were involved in it, you know the same TSA that Jim says, well, they screen these people, if that TSA wanted to take another look at the situation and wanted to talk to these folks again, then the TSA, I think, has to take some responsibility.

ZOGBY: Absolutely. No one is questioning that. What was going on here was people reported that they prayed. They said the name Allah and somebody said, although the people deny it, that they spoke out against the Iraq war. Well, duh. That’s a whole lot of people that we are talking about in this country, and that cannot rule you off an airplane.

ROBERTS: You would probably be throw half of the people in America off of the airplane.

ZOGBY: Well, the polls…

TING: My point is…

ROBERTS: Gentleman—unfortunately, gentlemen, we’re out of time. This is something we could continue to debate, and we will. We’ll keep following this story. Thanks very much for joining us. Appreciate it.

ZOGBY: Thanks.